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Lean Six Sigma

#1 Lean Six Sigma
06/02/2010 19:39


Hi All,

I was looking to find out the following; Does anybody know how/where to get Lean Six Sigma training/qualified if they are not being trained in-house? Also, what level should I start at i.e. do you have to follow the steps from green to black to master black belt or what's the best way to go about it? Any help would be great.



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#2 RE: Lean Six Sigma
07/02/2010 01:04

Certified Black Belt to Fred (#1)

Good sites to visit include:

You could get certified by American Society of Quality if you meet the conditions. Lean Six Sigma training/certification is quite expensive though, if you are planning to go it on your own.

You may not necessarily have to do Green Belt first before Black Belt. But a green Belt projct could give you a very firm grounding before embarking on a more challenging Black Belt project. Master Black Belts are the experienced Black Belts who have delivered many projects. Just like moving from Dr to Prof in the university

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#3 RE: Lean Six Sigma
08/02/2010 09:41

Fred to Certified Black Belt (#2)

Thanks for that, does anyone know of a good trainer in Ireland? Also, I was wondering, who is the main accrediting/governing body i.e. who is the overall body that actually sanctions the awarding the certificates?

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#4 RE: Lean Six Sigma
12/02/2010 19:54

sm to Fred (#3)

There isn't one single body (unlike accountancy) each company in theory can certify its own GB/BB.

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#5 RE: Lean Six Sigma
12/02/2010 23:14

Sat to sm (#4)


I know a GE Certified Master Black Belt. He is in the process of setting up a Six Sigma black belt training camp and it might not be as expensive as the big training providers and I am planning to join the training course which will be a 5 day workshop. If you need more informatin and are willing to travel to UK please reply back and I will put you in touch with him



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#6 RE: Lean Six Sigma
13/02/2010 10:11

R2D2 to Fred (#1)

Just a suggestion here but you migt want to start by differentiating between "Lean" & "Six Sigma". Despite the fact that the market puts them together they are in fact different things.

As far as training is concerned I am guessing that your interest is based upon the recent uptake of Lean within service type environments? If so be aware that this is rlatively new ground and teh Lean tools and techniques can require significant adaptation. As such there are no "experts" in Lean for Service and you should not pay good money to be taught Lean for Manufacturing. The best advice I can give you with minimal investment in get some of the excellent texts by John Bicheno - Cradiff Uni and get reading. I think his thoughts are probably closet to where Lean for Service is right now.

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#7 RE: Lean Six Sigma
15/02/2010 19:30

C3PO to R2D2 (#6)

R2D2 is absolutely right, they're not the same thing and I've never understood why the terms are used interchangeably.

I've done some research into the area and expected Cranfield or Warwick to shine, but it seems Cardiff are top of the class.

There are of course plenty of good texts too.

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#8 RE: Lean Six Sigma
15/02/2010 21:01

Certified Black Belt to deleted (#0)

Separating Lean from Six Sigma is a monumental mistake. Whilst I agree that they are two different concepts, but in many ways they are overlapping. Whilst lean focuses mainly on improving efficiency through minimisation of waste, Six Sigma is about increasing effectiveness by minimising process variation and doing things right first time. So to achieve a robust improvement, the two concepts should work hand in gloves , hence the growing empasis on Lean Six Sigma. Some of the improvement tools are also employed in both cases, e.g VSM. My lean six sigma expertise is in transaction environment, though in a manufacturing industry. I am currently doing a Ph.D on Lean Six Sigma, with particular emphasis on its application in a transaction (service) environment.

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#9 RE: Lean Six Sigma
16/02/2010 12:29

Evil Consultant to Certified Black Belt (#8)

"Separating Lean from Six Sigma is a monumental mistake."

I don't think that this is necessarily at issue here, rather than a lot of people seem to think that they are the same thing. They are not, and indeed, their underlying philosophies are quite different. If one is to successfully reconcile these different approaches and produce a unified methodology, then their underlying principles must first be understood in isolation.

Generally, when people conflate two separate terminologies it is a sign that they do not understand either!


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#10 RE: Lean Six Sigma
16/02/2010 13:15

Recruiter to Evil Consultant (#9)

Have to disagree with EC & R2D2 here. Although "Lean" and "Six Sigma" are different, (clearly, they are spelt and pronounced differently...) they are complementary and most people find it better to be trained in both simultaneously rather than each in isolation.

More service environments suit a combination of the two, with Lean more prolific at the start of the programme, (and more at the heart of the philosophy if you want to bring that part in) and Six Sigma being used alongside in instances where a more rigorous statistical approach is suitable. As CBB points out there is an obvious overlap that helps the two to fit together.

It doesn't mean people don't understand either Lean or Six Sigma, it just happens that the two work together well to form if you like a "new" terminology, Lean Six Sigma.

Also, there are plenty of experts in LSS for Services, just no universally agreed approach. It's not an exact science. Some of these guys do come from Manufacturing backgrounds originally (like John Bicheno and the Cardiff Uni lot, who I do agree run the best course of it's type).

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#11 RE: Lean Six Sigma
16/02/2010 17:16

R2D2 to R2D2 (#6)

Very interesting reponses here but to clarify I do not suggest that you should separate the two things in practice only that you should differentiate between the two for the purposes of study. I have found that starting with lean sets a framework out and a methodology and an approach which gives the bigger picture. Six sigma fits well within this framework and does indeed share many of the same tools and has been undeniably beneficial to many organisations.

From a layman's point of view I still suggest that lean is the place to start and six sigma can be studied in detail later

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#12 RE: Lean Six Sigma
02/01/2011 21:50

pistol to R2D2 (#11)

One thing that I find annoying about the whole lean vs six sigma is that having a black belt in six sigma has no equivalent in lean. I have green belt six sigma and deep lean experience but there is no equivalent black belt to get that excludes six sigma.

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#13 RE: Lean Six Sigma
05/01/2011 22:11

victor to pistol (#12)

Try this

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#14 RE: Lean Six Sigma
06/01/2011 21:50

Steve to victor (#13)

One earlier poster correctly stated that LERC (Lean Enterprise Research Centre) at Cardiff Business School are top of the tree, which is correct.

Try - these guys offer courses dedicated to Lean Service (the big market opportunity) and are authorised to accredit on behalf of LERC at Cardiff University.

I attended their last open course and it was very worthwhile.

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#15 RE: Lean Six Sigma
07/01/2011 22:34

Pistol to Steve (#14)

My issue is not so much the dirth of Lean qualifications rather that unlike with green/black belt in six sigma the lean quals are less well known and therefore less appealing in the jobs market. Given that Lean is very much the hot topic right now in Services I find it strange that this is not representative in the demand for people Lean qualified over being Six Simga qualified.

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#16 RE: Lean Six Sigma
26/04/2011 23:04

top of the ops? to Pistol (#15)

Apologies for bringing up an old post, but 12 months on, I just wanted to ask if anyone on here has studied at Catdiff Business School and have been taught by the "LERC lot".

Will having Cardiff Uni's LERC on the CV carry more clout in a job application for Ops Consulting / Business Turn-arond, over other Universities (even top tier)??

Thoughts, and comments much appreciated.


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#17 RE: Lean Six Sigma
03/05/2011 10:43

anono mouse to top of the ops? (#16)

Regarding your query about training in Ireland,

it's part of the MSc in Technology Management from but i think you can do the modules as standalone training if you want in UCC, UL or UCG.

If you contact someone at they might be able to help you out regarding other trainers in Ireland.

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#18 RE: Lean Six Sigma
30/06/2011 09:48

Sententia to top of the ops? (#16)


I'm a grad of the LERC MSc programme (service ops). If you want to get a better handle on lean from an intervention and a systems perspective I would fully recommend it. It opened my eyes to how much I didn't know

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#19 RE: Lean Six Sigma
29/09/2014 09:22

amitkawade to Fred (#1)


My name is Amit and I am Six Sigma Black belt certified and working as Head process excellence with one of the company. I have over 12 Years of experience in Six Sigma.

I have prepared course material related to the Six Sigma Black belt and wanted to share with people who are interested in the same.

It Consists of

1) Complete Six Sigma Black Belt course material.

2) 5-6 Sample Green Belt and Black Belt projects (Which are actually implemented).

3) Excel based tool Kit.

4) Complete user guide of "How to use MINITAB".

This is prepared in such a way that person new to six sigma can understand it.

If anyone is interested for the same please mail to

Would love to share my work.



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#20 RE: Lean Six Sigma
31/12/2015 15:32

Omega to amitkawade (#19)

Could you help me please with the decision - what Six Sigma certifying organisation is the most popular and recognised in the UK? And it is worth the sweat getting a certificate? I use Six Sigma at my work, my organisation does not require having Six Sigma, but I am thinking of going back to management consulting and hope Six Sigma will help me there.

Thank you

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#21 RE: Lean Six Sigma
11/01/2017 12:16

Ifqindia to Fred (#1)

best site for six sigma training

For those planning to go to US or work with a US company in India can apply for the six sigma black belt certification. We prepare students for application to ASQ Black Belt examination at the right time.

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