Thread List
First Page Previous Page Page 141 / 320 Next Page Last Page
Subject#Latest
4 31.05.09
2 31.05.09
4 29.05.09
4 28.05.09
5 28.05.09
9 28.05.09
5 27.05.09
2 27.05.09
3 26.05.09
4 26.05.09
5 26.05.09
9 26.05.09
3 25.05.09
3 24.05.09
6 23.05.09
16 22.05.09
6 22.05.09
1 22.05.09
5 22.05.09
1 22.05.09
1 22.05.09
3 21.05.09
9 21.05.09
1 21.05.09
17 21.05.09
26 21.05.09
3 21.05.09
11 21.05.09
8 21.05.09
2 19.05.09
11 18.05.09
5 18.05.09
6 18.05.09
19 18.05.09
25 16.05.09
2 16.05.09
4 15.05.09
3 15.05.09
6 15.05.09
6 15.05.09
5 15.05.09
6 14.05.09
11 14.05.09
2 14.05.09
9 14.05.09
1 13.05.09
5 13.05.09
5 13.05.09
13 13.05.09
3 13.05.09
First Page Previous Page Page 141 / 320 Next Page Last Page

Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??

 
#1 Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
12/05/2009 22:27

Q

I don't know why people on this board think that MBBB are better that the other Big 4 consultancies:

- pay is about the same

- MBBB your timespan is less, so less of a career model

- MBBB has candidates who are nerds - i mean, come on, MBBB sports teams are a spotted farce

- Most MBBB (and Big 4) wont end up partners

- Big 4 partner pay blows MBBB partner pay out of the water

- Big 4 has more access to fitter women

- The average MBBB candidate has a higher debt from their MBA, which over the long run doesn't pay off because a harder worker at Big 4 will do just as well money-wise (and even better)

So basically, MBBB is just a marketing thing praying on the flimsy minds who equate high grades and MBAs to genuine success...anyone who wants to question that just look at the fortune 500 CEO backgrounds.

Reply  Quote   
 
#2 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 08:07

MBB Consultant to Q (#1)

How can you write such non-sense? Comparing MBB with Big 4 is like comparing Rolls-Royce and Fiat.

MBB are way better because their projects are far more interesting. Even when you don't do strategy you still work for the top management, while at your big 4 you will barely see a senior executive while mapping processes or ticking boxes on a PMO role in an IT-driven programme.

It helps a lot to have a MBB on your CV (McKinsey for me) even if you don't end up partner and yes of course the pay is better you idiot!

Reply  Quote   
 
#3 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 08:24

R to MBB Consultant (#2)

Unfortunately, the thought of having to work with people like the poster above means I would take a job with Accenture any day over MBB.

Reply  Quote   
 
#4 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 08:36

Ex-MBB to R (#3)

As somebody who has worked for 2 of the MBB's, I would never go back there again. Some great people there, and great work too - but the hours and the travel stopped it being viable for me. Plus, some of the senior guys were right ruthless b*stards, and I couldn't stand the politics of people constantly trying to score points off of one another. No job security either - I hated that feeling of dread every time an appraisal came up and I just couldn't tell if I would still be in a job 3 months hence. Also, the whole 'collegiate atmosphere' thing did my head in. I'm 37, not some grad that still wants to be part of a frat house hanging out with 'the guys' at 11.00pm on a Friday night.

Reply  Quote   
 
#5 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 11:46

Pirlo to R (#3)

"Big 4 partner pay blows MBBB partner pay out of the water"

I think you are massively delusional on this front. Last time i checked its at least 3x, remember they are private companies.

Reply  Quote   
 
#6 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 11:59

anon to Pirlo (#5)

who do you think earns more:

somebody who sells teams of say 5-10 people at a fairly high daily rate throughout the year? (MBB)

or

somebody who sells teams of 20-50 people at a slightly lower daily rate throughout the year? (Big 4)

It's a pyramid model, and no matter how "powerful, clever and important" the person at the top of the pyramid is, it is at the end of the day about numbers...

And besides, aren't big 4 private companies too??? (ACN notably not being either a private company or in the Big 4)

Reply  Quote   
 
#7 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 12:11

Tony Restell (Top-Consultant.com) to anon (#6)

I would say Pirlo is correct - a Partner at an MBBB strategy firm would typically earn considerably more than a Partner at a Big 4. There are a handful of the most senior partners at the Big 4 who are up in the £700k-800k earnings bracket, but the majority of Partners would only be on 1/4 to 1/3 of this sum. Whereas at a strategy firm you'd expect most Partners to be earning north of £400k.

Tony Restell

Top-Consultant.com

Reply  Quote   
 
#8 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 13:19

WellBMe to Tony Restell (Top-Consultant.com) (#7)

Well 800k is the average at Deloitte - the most senior partner earns 3.5m+ and the heads of various departments or industries walk away with 1.2m+. New partners start on 300k+ (final one is a guess).

Reply  Quote   
 
#9 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 18:01

Ex Deloitte Strategy to WellBMe (#8)

The point re Deloitte is well made. Anyone that knows the Strategy practice (c.150 FTEs) will confirm that most of the Partners are unlikely to be interested in getting out of bed for less than 300k. Heads of industry within the Strat practice are much more likely to fall between 400k-750k. Not sure if I envy their position; the Deloitte partnership is tough to get into and even tougher to remain part of. The revenue targets in themselves are a tall order and then there's all the extra curricular stuff too. Easier money to be had in industry.

Reply  Quote   
 
#10 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 21:12

anal-ist to Ex Deloitte Strategy (#9)

To answer the question (and I work for Accenture), the reason in my mind that MBB would be preferable is that you have far better exit options (PE, Research, Industry Strategy, Commercial Management) and a far more relevant skillset developed for interesting jobs.

Reply  Quote   
 
#11 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
13/05/2009 23:44

anon to Q (#1)

Quick reply

- False: the difference in salary is massive. A grad at Big4 earns 30% less than in MBB

- Career opportunities for top performers are huge in MBB. True, if you are not a top performer you will be kicked out pretty soon.

- Some MBB candidates are nerds, most are brilliant

- True, it's hard ending up partners. However, is it easy to become CEO of a company starting from the very bottom?

- No way, MBB partners earns more than Big4 ones

- Probably u are right about women

- Againg, the average MBB candidate will outperform any Big4 candidate career-wise and money-wise

Reply  Quote   
 
#12 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
14/05/2009 07:36

Big Consultant to anon (#11)

- pay in MBBB is from 10% to about 40% more (the increase is in correlation with rising grade)

- Your timespan might be less in MBBB but you have a better exit option into industry. Most likely, you will be hired at higher grade & pay and quicker to move into a senior role in line management.

- MBBB candidates are likely to lack traditional and tested social skills. Not the best people you will want to hang with.

- Right. Applies to both camps although MBBB provides a better chance of entering senior roles in industry on the other hand

- Big 4 partner pay blows MBBB partner pay out of the water probably for the top 5% of partners. I think on average, MBBB partners earn more

- No doubt, ugly birds and fewer birds in MBBB

- On average MBBB people make more money

All that said I will rather work in a reputable big 4 than an MBBB.

It is hard enough we have to sell part of our lives (9-5) to get food on the table and a roof over our heads.

It is OK to sell a bit more (8-8) in consulting to get extra cash, interesting and stimulating work, prestige etc. But at least you have your weekends and a couple of hours in the week to live.

But at MBBB you sell all your life (8-12 + most weekends) and significantly take up more stress (up or out) for 40% more pay. If you work 70hrs a week and always on the road or in the air, and constantly worry about your job there is not much to your life except work. I don't want an MBBB life for 200% more pay, talkless of 40%.

Reply  Quote   
 
#13 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
14/05/2009 20:37

Anonymous to Big Consultant (#12)

"On average MBBB people make more money"

Entirely untrue actually. I'm a pay consultant and can tell you that I've benchmarked all the MBBB and they pay the same as each other and the same as the accounting Big 4. This is by design - there is an explicit pay strategy benchmarked to deliver pay at market median and no higher. Partner earnings are in fact lower in the MBB; there simply isn't the scale or leverage in these businesses to deliver Big 4-level returns. What the MBBB use to attract and retain people is their brand, not money - hence why they get away with paying so much less than financial services.

I also don't believe there is any justification to claim that MBB alumni enter industry at higher levels or on higher pay than Big-4 consultants. The fact is that industry recruiters do not value consulting experience (from any firm) that highly.

Reply  Quote   
 
#14 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
14/05/2009 21:07

jj to Anonymous (#13)

Original poster (Q) criticises those who value high grades and MBAs. Yet his own aspirations are based on high partner pay and fitter women. This seems to me to be just as shallow if not more so.

btw 39% of fortune 500 CEOs have MBAs and another 30% have other post-grad degrees. So whilst only a small proportion of MBAs reach the top it does seem that an MBA is a requirement.

Reply  Quote   
 
#15 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
15/05/2009 16:24

another deluded MBBB to jj (#14)

"Comparing MBB with Big 4 is like comparing Rolls-Royce and Fiat."

Unfortunately for you, the traditional lines which would have made this true are much more blurred. I work for a Big 4 firm and at the client I'm doing the interesting work whilst the rival BCG consultant runs around data collecting and generally doing grunt contractor work.

Not Rolls Royce v Fiat any more, the expansion of strategy houses to other less value adding activities means it's now more often Audi v Skoda - there gap in brands is there but 1) the top end isn't that exclusive any more, and 2) under the bonnet it's pretty much the same thing.

Reply  Quote   
 
#16 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
15/05/2009 16:32

noon to another deluded MBBB (#15)

sure, but you don't buy a Skoda if you want a sport differential with customized torque distribution.

Reply  Quote   
 
#17 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
15/05/2009 17:41

Skoda Driver to noon (#16)

Hey, there's nothing wrong with Skodas! I drive a rusty 20 year old Skoda because my boss wouldn't give me a car allowance. When I turn up at the client site, I go out of my way to make sure I park as close to the reception and/or office windows as I can. People frequently comment on "that rusty, clapped out, chocolate brown pile of cr@p outside". I'm also always the first to offer a lift, if the team needs to be driven somewhere. I'm just waiting for the day when anybody criticises me for it. I'll tell them exactly why I drive around in that pile of cr@p.

Reply  Quote   
 
#18 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
16/05/2009 15:52

anon to Skoda Driver (#17)

So essentially most of you are saying 'I want you to be jealous of me and my gang, and my boss has a bigger salary than yours'.

How petty and what a very poorly articulated thread.

Reply  Quote   
 
#19 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
18/05/2009 20:31

Q to anon (#18)

I am the OP.

I have a senior position in an MBBB firm and spent many years with a Big 4 consultancy. So I am speaking from experience.

The most salient point is that the MBBB brand adds a certain amount of value which can be offset with salary - take my word for it, MBBB'ers are not particularly financially better off than other Big 4 high flyers - to the point the whole 'MBBB' hype would have you believe...

Reply  Quote   
 
#20 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
18/05/2009 20:33

Q to Q (#19)

Also, as an MBA holder myself from a top 5 business school, I can honestly say that I have worked with some seriously ill-logic driven people within MBBB in my time...I am not saying that Big 4 is better - it is not...what I am saying is that MBBB is so overhyped its stupid.

I really hope clients are able to see past the brand hyping, which is evident enough on this forum!

Reply  Quote   
 
#21 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
20/05/2009 04:16

P to Q (#20)

Don't know how this compares to MBB but I just left the Big 4 as a Senior Manager to go into industry. I'm 32 and my base was £100k, bonus 30% (admitedly my best ever year).

Directors earn £100-140k base + much higher bonus potential. Best thing was my usual office hours were 8 - 6 with the VERY occasional all nighter or weekend but this happened maybe once or twice a year max.

Hope that helps. P

Reply  Quote   
 
#22 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
20/05/2009 13:05

Big Consultant to P (#21)

I think Engagement Managers in the likes of MBB (from entry-level, 5-8 years experience) earn between £80-120K with roughly 20-30% in bonuses. I take it yours is about 10 years experience?

Principals/Directors earn about £140-200K, don't know bonuses.

I stand to be corrected.

Not much apart to be frank.

Reply  Quote   
 
#23 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
20/05/2009 19:35

rcs to Big Consultant (#22)

MBB EM range is 60-90k GBP

Reply  Quote   
 
#24 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
21/05/2009 07:54

Cynic to rcs (#23)

Noooo.... it's more than that. The last time I was at MBB, a fresh MBA would be on £65 + 20% bonus. A junior EM was more like £120K. From there upwards, it became a little mysterious though. Either way, I remember thinking that the money was good but it still wasn't a good enough deal given the hours, travel, stress etc. The work was pretty good though. Exit options wear off about 3 years after you've left.

Reply  Quote   
 
#25 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
21/05/2009 09:45

Evil Consultant to Cynic (#24)

Indeed, it's way more than that.

A recent MBA of my acquaintance is on nearer £80k before bonus. Even the tier 2 firms offer £70k for an associate.

EC

Reply  Quote   
 
#26 RE: Why do you think MBB are actually better than Accenture, Deliotte, KPMG et al??
21/05/2009 12:14

Barr to Cynic (#24)

There's quite an overlap between MBA/Associate and EM bands. I wouldn't have thought there's a 2x differential at any firm. £120k (and let's be clear we're all talking good ol' pounds sterling here, not dollars) is Director/Associate Partner territory.

Reply  Quote   

Top of Page

ThreadID: 54776

Advertise
Your Jobs!